Frankly, I really don't care what they say, and I have my reasons, but that would be a compleatly different topic. Notice how I said that this is my opinion, smart guy. You don't have to believe me, after all, I'm just an idiot right?
How can you say such things Gilgamesh? Gay's have it bad enough without people like you who are ignorant to their situation. There are over 240,000,000 gays in the world right now, as 4% of the earth's population is homosexual. That is equivalent to every American citizen being gay. You can't oppress the gayness out of them, let them be, and learn to tolerate them.
Homophobe is an insult because they are ignorant jackasses! I can equal you to a racist. It is the change we should be going for, where other people are accepted, and prejudiced people are left in the dust.
Steve Zissou: Anne-Marie, do all the interns get Glocks?
Draw a comparison between gays and Jews. (Stay with me here.) Hitler hated Jews and oppressed them; did they all lay down and die or convert just because some guy (albeit with power and a big army) said their religious beliefs were wrong? Nope. The same's true of gay people. You can beat them up if you want, but that's not going to change much. They can't do anything about their sexual preference, and nobody else can change it either. And it's not like they're going to turn heterosexuals gay, is it?
Gays adopting children is totally wrong, it seriously messes up the children. Think what it would be like at school for them...
"Shame you have two dads"
"Haha you have gay parents."
It'd end up in suicide, I know I would if I had two fags gallivanting around the house naked and kissing each other.
Don't get me wrong, if they want to be gay, then let them be gay. I just am against them thinking they should be parents. Parents should consist of a man and a women, not a man or a man, or a woman and a woman. Let's keep the balance right.
CB: "And it's not like they're going to turn heterosexuals gay, is it?"
What about Queer Eye for the Straight guy?
Anyways, I think some of you have got me totally wrong, IE, Pete. I'm not trying to bash gays, although I don't think that homosexuality is right, I'm not trying to hurt the people. I said that it is, and still believe that it is a mental illness, meaning that they should get help. Now, I'm not talking about gay traits or anything like that, just the sexual fact.
Regardless of what the APA says, I don't think it's right just to go and believe them, or any of those other places/people/objects, neither is it right to just up and believe someone like me. It's always good to form your own opinions on things. In my opinion, I believe that the APA and other of those are human, and they do have their own minds. You have said that homosexuals don't chose to be gay, yet to me that makes it seem even more of a mental illness. If homosexuality isn't a mental illness, then they'd have to take away other mental illnesses, like anti-social people, or schitzophrenics, or whatever else you can think of. After all, they don't choose to do the things they do, do they? Pete, you told me that feeling sorry for gays is stupid, well, people do that. That's problably how it was taken off of being a mental illness.
The APA obviously also does not know their history. Let's go back to the Roman Empire. Back then homosexuality was the opposite of what it was today. It was less talked about but done more often. But when it was talked about, the argument was that it was ok. So a woman was for making children, and another man was for a good time. That's what I was refering to in one of my previous posts. How would you like it if homosexuality was widely accepted? How would you react if all your children turned out to be gay?
On to something else, JP, you said that homophobes are jackasses, what about the people that assume that everyone who doesn't like gays are afraid of them? Like I said, I don't like gays, but I'm not scared of them, nor do I think you should go around bashing them. So to say that I'm oppressing them is retarded. And it's wrong to put them on the same level as a race.
Have you ever seen the show? They help unclean straight men improve their standard of living to attract females. Usually they make then dinner then propose. If you are worried about gay's converting you then you have underlying issues with your own sexuality. I don't care if someone is gay or not, if I am around a homosexual I am not worried that I will suddenly want a wank in my mouth, because I know I like titties and clams.
"Regardless of what the APA says, I don't think it's right just to go and believe them,"
These guys at the APA are experts. Doctors. They know what they are talking about. You are going to have to trust other people in your life. They do not know their history? When did history ever become an issue. Back in the Roman times it was just accepted. Even the Roman emperors were gay, such as:
Ortho- had hair plucked from his body, wore a wig, shaved daily and smeared his face with moist bread so he would never have a beard. He is rumored to have been Nero's lover.
Domitian - It is uncertain that the rumors that he had sex with boys and was paid for sex with Nerva amongst others was but a political smear.
Trajan - is said to have been enamored of boys including a pantomime dancer Pylades and is said to have treated his lovers well.
In Greece, male nudity was a widespread phenomenon of Greek life. Nudity was practiced not only in the gymnasia but also at religious ceremonies, at public festivals and at private feasts where the young cupbearers and dancers were usually nude.
I didn't say homophobes necessarily are afraid, but they hold them in contempt. There are a lot of people like you out there, which is why gays are being held down.
Steve Zissou: Anne-Marie, do all the interns get Glocks?
So your saying that the APA is correct in every single instance? Are they gods or something where they can make any decision and they are correct? So what if they're experts? Martial Artist experts make mistakes occasionally. They're human, they're able to make mistakes. George Bush and all those other presidents are so called "experts" at running this country and they make all sorts of mistakes and disicions in running the US. There are thousands of other people that everyone says they suck at what they do, but for some reason, anyone whose in Psychology is Perfect.
What is your problem anyways? Your acting like I'm trying to kill them? Are you gay or something? I said they need help. And I also said that gay traits don't matter. The only thing about them that needs to be changed is the fact that they sleep with other men. Kind of like taking one of those dirty incestous southerners and taking away the incestous part. They can still act southern and be like the sterotypical dirty incestous southerner, accept they sleep with normal people. Your like totally taking this like an insult and its just wacky. Well anywho...
"How would you like it if homosexuality was widely accepted? How would you react if all your children turned out to be gay?"
it is widely accepted. welcome to the 21st century, get over it. do you live in a town where there are no gay bars and Will & Grace is banned from public broadcast?
if my kids turned out to be gay, how would i react? what, you think that i'd care the slightest? they'd still be my kids. i'd still love them. i'd respect them for what they are and not what i want them to be.
and we're not talking about opinions here. we're talking about FACTS. it is a FACT that homosexuality is not a disorder. just like you can't have the "opinion" that the world is flat, you are disproven by science.
and mental illness is a mental illness if it IMPEDES daily functionality. schizophrenia stops you from having a normal life. psychopathy stops you from having a normal life. homosexuality does not. therefore it is not a mental illness. people don't feel sorry for gays, they RESPECT them just as they respect anyone else. in fact, if a man next to me stood up and shouted "i'm gay!", i'd have more respect for him, because he'd be standing up to the mindless homophobes like you.
I'm not saying that the APA is always correct, but that unlike martial arts experts, many of them together do independent studies and compare their results, to end up with their conclusion. Compared to what, your opinion on the subject, that’s just how you were raised, you probably heard someone say it was a mental illness.
My problem is that you want to force change in them. If I was gay would that be a problem? I think I have already stated that I am not gay, and I feel queasy when two men kiss.
As for incest, gays don't harm anyone, but when you have sex with your sister, there are bound to be birth defects in the baby.
Steve Zissou: Anne-Marie, do all the interns get Glocks?
"it is widely accepted. welcome to the 21st century, get over it."
If it's sooo widely accepted, then how come there's always still a discussion about it? I'm sure it it was sooo widely accepted, no one would give two shits about gays being married, but there are still a lot of people that do.
"if my kids turned out to be gay, how would i react? what, you think that i'd care the slightest? they'd still be my kids. i'd still love them. i'd respect them for what they are and not what i want them to be."
You say that now, but just you wait. Anybody can just say something, now you just have to prove it some how.
JP: "I didn't say homophobes necessarily are afraid, but they hold them in contempt."
Homophobes ARE afraid. Homophobe is short for homophobia, is it not? And a phobia, I thought, was something you are afraid of, I guess I must have been wrong.
Pete: "and we're not talking about opinions here. we're talking about FACTS. it is a FACT that homosexuality is not a disorder. just like you can't have the "opinion" that the world is flat, you are disproven by science."
Me (VERY FIRST POST): "What are your opinions on gay marraiges?"
I believe that's the conversation here, smart guy. I think we're having two differnt conversations here, pete. I'm here just stating my opinion, and your out here on a crusade to change mine. Let me just say this pete, you are not going to change my opinion, nor do I think I'm going to change yours, or JP's, or anyone elses for that matter. You can't just have an argument and expect the other guy to go, Oh yeah, your exactly right, what was I thinking. So, I suggest that we all just calm down so that we don't get into a stupid hissy fit about stuff.
arguing is pointless but that doesn't mean it isn't fun.
look, you are presenting an incorrect fact as an opinion. it's like me saying "it is my opinion that the world is flat". it's a stupid opinion to have, because it is wrong. hitler believed that the jews needed to be exterminated. he was wrong. opinions can be wrong, and some opinions need to be changed in order to make the world more harmonious - forgive the hippy talk. i'm not getting in a hissy fit, i'm just pushing the point. also, you've started the post, and it's gone off on a slight, not-so-unpredictable tangent - which you've run with. you can't try and stop the debate just by saying we're off topic.