I agree with all points Digitalic makes; Clickteam clearly isn't doing enough for their awesome softwares. I certainly hope Clickteam takes all of these points into account and will do something about them. Ever since TDC turned more into an indie site instead of a more klik-based site, it seems more new users have been coming (I still miss Mitch). If Clickteam updated their site, I would assume it would attract more users.
If there is so much concern for this, why doesn't the community get together and advertise Multimedia Fusion? I am sure there is a lot of material that can be used to demonstrate the capabilities of Multimedia Fusion (and The Games Factory). I am also sure there is enough talent within the community to properly SEO such a website. Personally I don't see why I would want to burden Clickteam with complaints about their advertising and marketing strategies when it makes very little difference to me as a user of their products. All it will do is divert attention away from production on features I am extremely keen to see released, such as an Android runtime.
But it's really not our job. I like Clickteam and all, but it's not our job to do their business. I also like Starbucks but I wouldn't mop their floors for them (nor "Like" them on Facebook.)
As a supporter of Clickteam and a daily user of MMF, our concerns come mainly from frustration; we all know that Clickteam are sitting on a small wonder of a product but they don't seem to want to market it much, all the while other products are attracting users. Some suggestions wouldn't even cost money (only time) to implement: a free, feature-limited MMF demo; a greater emphasis on user-created games on Clickteam's website, for example.
Clickteam are probably doing quite well financially, but I believe they could be doing so much better, and more importantly, more could be done to ensure that other products don't run away with potential MMF users. Sure, we can help by doing what we can to spread the word but I sure hope they have a better marketing strategy than that.
I see YoYoGames, with its community and integrated GameMaker product/showcase/community website. I'm not saying we need to have everything that everyone else has, but even a hint of some movement in that direction would be nice. Right now there's a company site with a forum, and a community site (this one) that's 99% coded and paid for by one guy.
Well for one, time is money. Obviously I don't disagree with (many of) the statements made by people expressing how much potential there is in the click products, I just fail to understand why people have such a personal interest in its success. You are right nim, mopping the floors in Starbucks is of no benefit to you at all, but I am also guessing you wouldn't provide a free "consultation" on how to best market their products either, which is essentially what's going on here. I can only see people getting frustrated because they want to see this community grow bigger, which explains why people might have a personal interest in how well Click products do in comparison to the competition. If this is the case then why isn't promoting Clickteam's products a fair suggestion? You can promote Clickteam in your own interest, and yes in many ways that is doing Clickteam's work, but it would first and foremost be an attempt to increase numbers in the community. Personally I care more about the state of the products than the state of their image. I would implement new features for my own benefit; just look at how many people write extensions for MMF2 and release them for free. If you care about the number of people taking up Clickteam's products there is something you can do about it other than aimlessly moaning about it on a forum.
Moreover, I am sure Clickteam are not completely stupid, and who really knows what future plans they have? I don't know what Clickteam's business strategies are, but I am sure they exist, and I would give them enough credit to believe they have thoughts to the same effect. For all we know they could already be developing a new image, they are just waiting for something to launch it with. Either way this makes no difference to me as a user of their products.
Promoting just requires some good games which have been made with a click product and some kind of huge billboard screaming the product that has been used for the creation Really loved that promotion screen after closing a knp or tgf app
In order to something like yoyogames, tdc needs a fusion with clickteam But why being a copycat, apart from the fact that clickteam might never do such a thing?
Anyways I am ratling, perhaps the original thread starter, Digitalic, could create a good looking UK site and offer that to clickteam. That would sure make him happy, but probably not clickteam because they show less interest in this area.
Let them just create good products and let us use them.
Originally Posted by ~Matt Esch~ I just fail to understand why people have such a personal interest in its success. I can only see people getting frustrated because they want to see this community grow bigger, which explains why people might have a personal interest in how well Click products do in comparison to the competition. If this is the case then why isn't promoting Clickteam's products a fair suggestion? You can promote Clickteam in your own interest, and yes in many ways that is doing Clickteam's work, but it would first and foremost be an attempt to increase numbers in the community. Personally I care more about the state of the products than the state of their image. I would implement new features for my own benefit; just look at how many people write extensions for MMF2 and release them for free. If you care about the number of people taking up Clickteam's products there is something you can do about it other than aimlessly moaning about it on a forum.
Moreover, I am sure Clickteam are not completely stupid, and who really knows what future plans they have? I don't know what Clickteam's business strategies are, but I am sure they exist, and I would give them enough credit to believe they have thoughts to the same effect. For all we know they could already be developing a new image, they are just waiting for something to launch it with. Either way this makes no difference to me as a user of their products.
Of course Clickteam does what's best for them. We don't have to know their plans to discuss our own ideas. I don't see any reason why community members could not share thoughts and improvement ideas if that's what is in their interests. Freedom of speech.
Actually, this topic, even though it has certain critic towards Clickteam, is a favor for them - or that how it should be perceived. It's full of ideas and user feedback. There is NOTHING in this topic that harms their way of doing this. It's only helping. (though I'm not sure if they are listening because these threads get locked immediately at their own forum. Hopefully they don't consider feedback as "moaning"...not that great of an attitude). Most companies pay for consumer feedback to improve their offerings! Clickteam is lucky to have a very active and loyal - though a bit small in volume - customer base who are concerned about everything that relates to their activities.
It's everybody's benefit if the user base expands due to better marketing and business development. That will mean more resources to further development of the software and will eventually benefit everyone of us. If business is bad, there might not be another MMF, ever. I have spent 1000 euros on click products and looking forward to spend another... and I think I'm entitled to express my opinion about it.
"Don't moan here - go promoting instead" - I'm sorry but this is total blahblahblah. Nothing will ever come out of this kind of hobbyist thinking. The sales impact with this will be nothing but peanuts. If you run a business, you need to look at marketing much more systematically than like "hey, here's our great product, hopefully our customers will tell everybody about it *fingers crossed*. Marketing is an investment, not a wishing well.
Of course Clickteam does what's best for them. We don't have to know their plans to discuss our own ideas. I don't see any reason why community members could not share thoughts and improvement ideas if that's what is in their interests. Freedom of speech.
Who was suggesting the latter?
"Don't moan here - go promoting instead" - I'm sorry but this is total blahblahblah. Nothing will ever come out of this kind of hobbyist thinking.
Ok, lets all discuss marketing opportunities like we are experts and tell Clickteam how to run their business like that isn't some kind of "hobbyist thinking". Nobody is suggesting that the potential we have to make Click products more widely used is comparable to the power Clickteam has over that, but I think we can still make a positive impact rather than fruitlessly talking about it. I think the general message was fairly clear by the time the topic was locked. By all means express your opinion, but you could at least try to do something to help if you are concerned. I think outright rejecting the potential we have as a community to influence numbers resonates with the general downtrodden tone of this conversation.
A simple contribution like putting a page on this website introducing the click products to new users and SEO-ing that would address the "why don't click products show up on a google search for...". Either that would make a positive impact, or as you suggested, the sales impact will be "nothing but peanuts", in which case it was a poor point to make. Also more people could put the fueled by fusion (or something else if you think it's better) logos in their games to promote the tool. Criticising and making suggestions to Clickteam that benefit us all just isn't fair if we aren't prepared to help in a proactive manner. Sorry for trying to be the slightest bit positive.
Originally Posted by 0ko "Promoting just requires some good games which have been made with a click product"
Loads of awesome (and proffesional) games have been created with click products... trying to say Construct is decent earlier on, then laughing at that statement just makes you look even more foolish. Grow up.
One game that never ceases to amaze me no matter how long after I come back, was Eternal Daughter. Maybe it's because it was released at an impressionable age for me, but that game still drives a certain level of aw and respect from me, especially now that I'm old enough to understand and play it without complaining that it was too hard. I really enjoy it.
Ok, lets all discuss marketing opportunities like we are experts and tell Clickteam how to run their business like that isn't some kind of "hobbyist thinking".
Well, just to highlight that I'm not telling anybody to do anything. I'm just providing my thoughts, ideas and suggestions. Clickteam does what's best for them - my comments cannot harm their business in any way. And I do online sales business development as my profession, so I have a lot of opinions to share. Obviously there is criticism, but that shouldn't be viewed as so negative thing and something that hurts Clickteam or this community somehow.
I think we can still make a positive impact rather than fruitlessly talking about it.
Our views differ quite a bit. You are looking at this from a grass-root level. I'm trying to think a bit bigger on how the volumes really could be scaled up massively and not just like "5 more dev copies sold!!", if that would be the goal someday. Of course "every little helps", there IS naturally a positive impact (if not in sales, but awareness) if I put huge (and high quality) Clickteam ads to all of my games, sure. But that is not sustainable way to do it, you have to give all developers a real concrete incentive to do this, and systematically manage this sort of activity. I'm not saying the community shouldn't advertise Click products on their own time, but I strongly disagree that this would be some game-changing long term solution to rely on, IF the target is to really raise MMF where it belongs, i.e. more popular than Game Maker or any other directly competing piece of software. And I'm pretty damn sure Clickteam wouldn't mind that position. That's where these guys belong, they deserve more. You can criticize and still be positive, you know.. everyone of us wants CT to thrive.
Criticising and making suggestions to Clickteam that benefit us all just isn't fair if we aren't prepared to help in a proactive manner.
Making suggestions and giving feedback = helping. This thread has a lot of useful input for Clickteam, for example the name discussion that some people had a few pages back. The name is a simple and easy-to-change element which is of course only one detail but can really make a difference. Much bigger difference than "Fueled by Fusion" randomly somewhere in 100 click games.
How does a customer in general help a company conducting business? By purchasing their products, simple as that. The price tag should cover not only direct product costs but also marketing costs. So when I have paid 1000 euros, I have helped quite a lot in promoting the product. So please do not tell me that I haven't done my share.
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Edited by nim
Really loved that promotion screen after closing a knp or tgf app 
But why being a copycat, apart from the fact that clickteam might never do such a thing?
jenswa.neocities.org
everyone praises it, but I hate Eternal Daughter.
So please do not tell me that I haven't done my share.