"for example super meat boy is getting a lot of love recently. just look at this graphic. it looks SHIT! i believe that more than 80% of the users on the DC could have done this graphic. overall it looks like ANY FLASH ANIMATION i could find on newgrounds. seriously anyone could open up Adobe Flash and fart this graphic out of their ass but it doesn't matter...does it?"
To be fair, the original Meat Boy game was in fact a Flash game on Newgrounds.
"so what the hell are you even trying to say?
well i guess we have a lot of skilled people on here and currently we have a lot of platforms to code for. it will be amazing once clickteam released their exporter for iphone and android. i believe a lot of little companies will be popping up just like mushrooms creating games for phones. a lot of new MMF users - probably more support for clickteam ONCE people find out about those exporters (it's still such an unknown product)."
I think overall, you know what you're talking about. The only thing I can disagree with has a lot to do with the above quote. There are a lot of skilled people, we do have a lot of platforms, but with Clickteam? MMF will not pave the way for awesome indie games, not the way you seem to be talking about anyways; More on this in just a bit, but first another quote!
"But we are also back at scoring big if it is just YOU and a friend who share the same passion."
MMF is not well-suited for group projects. It's possible, I'm sure, but tedious to work around. Which wraps up with what I said in the previous paragraph: MMF will not not pave the way for awesome indie games, unless only one person is working on the game with MMF.
I highly doubt there will ever be an XNA runtime. XNA, and all the tools you need to make something with XNA, are free. It's free (as in, no royalties or splash screens required) to publish your XNA games for PC, too. I'll also argue that it's hundreds of times easier to create any given game in XNA than it is to create it with MMF2.
Now, if you're talking about an XNA runtime to publish for XBLIG... Yeah, there's an even slimmer chance of that happening. For a game to be sold on XBLIG, it has to undergo peer review. If a game fails peer review, then it won't be published, though the developer can fix the game and resubmit later. Here's a short list of ways a game can be failed:
• It uses copyrighted content. Fan games? None of those. Games with ripped sprites? Not gonna happen. Music from another game? Haha, fat chance.
• Strong sexual content. Full nudity or [gratuitous] partial nudity, sexual acts, or anything that would get a game rated M for Mature (or higher) will be failed.
• Excretion; If it isn't vomit, then the game will be failed for it. That means urine and feces, basically.
• Distasteful violence is a no-no too. That means genocide, torture, and mutilation are all great ways to have a game failed. Dismemberment and excessive blood/gore may also qualify for a fail.
• If the game crashes or hangs anywhere, including obscure situations, then the game will be failed. Most failings of this nature, should an XNA runtime somehow be released, will likely result from Clickteam's exporter for it than anything.
• If a game can only be played using one controller (player 1 on the console), then the game will be failed. How many people do you think will bother testing for this before exporting it? Fails galore, I'll bet.
• If the game is made without regard to the title safe area, you bet that's a fail. (If someone doesn't know what that means, here's Wikipedia to the rescue: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safe_area )
...and then this last one is my favorite:
• If the trial mode doesn't show off the actual game or is abused to release a game for free, then FAIL.
What I'm basically getting at, is that for a game to pass peer review the person making the game generally has to know what they're doing. To that end, I question why not just skip the middleman and develop using XNA directly? It's a hell of a lot more straightforward than using MMF.
Originally Posted by GamesterXIII The physics are really dumb in SMB.
Jumper did have a much better engine and more creative levels.
I own both the Xbox 360 version of Super Meat Boy and the Steam version, and both play great, both have tight controls and good physics, and both have interesting and varied level designs (seeing as they're the same game.) In my opinion, that is. Also, in case anyone is basing their opinions on the flash game, know that Super Meat Boy improves upon that game dramatically, to the point that I have major trouble playing the original. Also, Jumper was too slow a game for me in terms of how fast Ogmo moved.
But first off, that is all opinion.
Second, this isn't a Super Meat Boy thread so stop talking about it here.
Just become an electrician. You'll earn a bomb in today's economy (in the UK anyway) and learn the techniques you need to kit your car out with MMF-controlled products. Way better.
E.g. Get vista or windows 7 laptop, disconnect screen and bury it into dashboard at an angle, house laptop base under passenger seat, program an interface in MMF2 which displays the screen in mirror-image, and hook the machine up to the various different parts of the car. Then voila! You have a heads-up display on your windscreen (reflected from the screen inside the dash), and you can voice-control your car. Much more satisfying!
It's true that things have been improving a lot in recent times, with new platforms engines and tools being opened up to the small developer.
The main problem with the indie scene however is that it's still a massive circle-jerk and that's something that will not change any time soon.
You're either involved with the scene by going to conventions, being a regular poster in certain forums and so on or your chances are cut down by about 90%.
Getting the indie scene's approval ends up having a chain reaction with the outside press (as in, mainstream gaming press) starting to look at what your game. Sometimes even hitting extremes like giving some incredibly high scores when reviewing and so on. I've seen games like VVVVVV, Super meat boy and Cave Story Wii for example getting constant rankings above 90% in places like gamespot, ign and so on.
Not that these games are bad, Super meat boy is a good game for 15$ but overrated to death (for example, gamespot gave the game 95% which is astounding to say the least), VVVVVV is a blatant case of what I described above about the indie scene (the creator is a TIGS editor and the game is little more than a flash game with a generic gameplay gimmick used for the entire game) and Cave Story was completely broken at the time of the release, and coupled with several very questionable design decisions (such as having all the game modes unlocked at the beginning, spoiling the story if you play them).
These are only a few cases but there are many more.
The industry has also been moving in a direction I don't like much.
The current trend is to make small and generic flash (specially for facebook), and iphone games for easy money, I miss the times when people put years of work in a game.
Hopefully this will change, and I'm confident it will because some day those markets will be so clustered there will be no more money to be made ouf of them and those developers will be forced to change.
Originally Posted by GamesterXIII Making money with indie games is all about luck and being involved in the right communities, but there does seem to be a lot of support for indie titles lately.
Most of the indie games that have made it big so far are either mediocre or straight up garbage. Why do people like that awful "IWBTG" trash ?
SMB copied an old gamemaker game called Jumper. They claim to not have copied it which is a humongous lie. Jumper was actually fun and the charm didn't wear off after 20 seconds like it does in super meat boy. They did include jumper as a character though . . . big deal lol. Everything about the game is unoriginal and simple, yet many reviews claim for it to be "one of the best platformers ever." Not in a million years and it still doesn't compare to many games made 10 years ago.
Why do people like that awful "IWBTG" trash ?
I wanna be the guy is utter crap and I hate it but the reason why people like it is quite simple I believe. In fact there is a lot of "popular" stuff that's utter crap.
This is how I see it (and that's sadly the way it is): Do an awesome game with your original character and people won't care too much (in most cases). Just replace your sprite with Bart Simpsons, Sonic or any other famous character and BAM you've got a hit on your hands- popular character so people will check out your game and then your game is even coded well so yeh a winner is you.
But here is the catch: Do a crap game with a popular character and chances are good people will still care just because they like that character. They will ignore the awful engine.
I wanna be the boy
2d left 4 dead
or the Christmas Mega Man Flash game I have posted recently are just some examples
(and there is some upcoming 2d Alan Wake / Halo- so just get out one of your old games and replace your graphics so it will look like a popular title)
I wanna be the boy gets the attention because of 1) OMFG hardest game ever 2) haha mega man sprite
also according to what I have been told the guy who made I wanna be the boy is an utter prick. claiming his game is one of the best games EVER and if anyone dares to talk bad about it he will reply to it and tell that person to fuck off- how nice
Also I don't get the super meat boy hype either. I just hate how unoriginal the in game graphics are and how shit OH LOOK I JUST TRIED OUT FLASH the cutscene graphics are.
Originally Posted by Hayo So yeah these are really exciting times, with all the crappy games and asshole game creators.
Well Hayo I think I've to disagree with you.
While "I wanna be the boy" isn't a too good game and it's creator doesn't seem to be too nice you have to keep in mind not everyone is like this. There are a bunch of expectations. Also "I wanna be the boy" is a freeware game.
There are quite some GREAT indy games which have commercial success.
Here is a list of good games:
First of all I want to start with Angry Birds. There is probably no iphone owner who has not heard of this title. It's one of the most successful iphone games (probably even THE most successful iphone game).
I should also point out the Android version is completly FREE and makes a lot of money with banner ads.
Then we have got Doodle Jump for android / iOS. This game is so simple yet so addictive and fun. The Youtube video looks really dull and boring but you should give this game a try if you have not played it before / one of the millions of clones it got (you have to tilt your phone).
Now Limbo is probably the best indy game of the year. Get it for Xbox.
by now I am really to lazy to post more GREAT indy games but there are a bunch (braid, gish, stuff by derek yu you haven't even heard of...)