Dude, this is seriously annoying to come across. Granted, locking a topic does seem to ultimately stop discussion on the topic for a time, but it doesn't resolve any conflict. Eventually the topic comes up again, more ugly than before, users had more time to think about why they were right. Indeed, they might be correct, but the opposite has an equally strong opposition.
ADMINS:
Please, let the discussions work their natural course. No one's going to learn to get along unless they are given a chance. The worst that can happen is members getting hurt, and new members getting a bad impression of us. In reality, I'd be embarrassed to have new members see what disunity and wars go on, and eventually members will leave due to the hidden flames. Things could get worse before they get better, but not if we don't get the chance to make them that way.
MEMBERS:
We aren't even doing our part to make this a commmunity. It feels like we're individuals all in the same place, for the same purpose, but separate. Because of this, we can freely insult, flame and perform all sorts of malevolent, malicious actions to each other with hardly any consequence to ourselves.
We're all the same community. Unique individual interests and opinions, lives and goals. Yet, all human. Work through your differences, understand each side. Being right doesn't necessarily mean being correct.
We're laying the groundwork for the future of games, who knows what lies in the future, who TDC affects. I would rather it affects people for the better. And you?
Edited by Peblo
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
It sounds like a pretty good idea I guess, but the admins might as well break up an arguement by giving the flamers warnings. If it continues then they're banned until they can get along. It's like a spray bottle to a cat.
As far as I'm concerned, locking topics isn't supposed to resolve conflicts. It's used to prevent topics getting nasty, which a lot of people generally don't want to see. It's not up to us to resolve any conflicts members have with other people, it's up to the members themselves.
As much as we want to help the community, locking a topic is sometimes the only way to stop a conflict from continuing on the forums. If a new topic is created which continues that conflict, then the correct action for admins would be to warn the user who continued that conflict (and obviously lock that topic also). In my opinion locking topics is a better alternative to letting nasty discussions continue. It's used on many other discussion boards, and it's simply up to the admins to use that tool correctly (whether they do or not is a matter of opinion).
Though I guess it depends on what the majority opinion is about this matter, not just what my opinion is. As always we we're willing to listen to any ideas and suggestions people have regarding this or any other matter.
This is a signature. Have this one on me.
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
20th January, 2009 at 20:14:04 -
All I'm saying is no matter how many times you lock a topic, it will keep coming back until it is resolved. You've seen it happen over and over, with many different topics, each as bitter as the last. I'm just suggesting a way to finally resolve things.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
Though i completely understand where you are coming from, Peblo, i feel that locking topics may be the best alternative the admins have at the moment. I too am frustrated to find topics locked as they are begin to get interesting (before the flaming, that is!), however to let them continue allows the conversation to get more personal and more damaging to the site and its members as a whole.
Flava is right, it is up to the individuals to resolve issues they have with other members. Most rational-thinking people will take a step back after the topic has been locked, letting them 'cool off' somewhat. However some people just don't like each other at all and end up rubbing each other the wrong way at the drop of a hat (BrandonC and -Adam- in the latest case) and no amount of internet-talking may be able to resolve this. Most of us on this site cannot talk to each other unless it's over a keyboard and therefore it is harder to resolve personal issues. It is also easier to attack people and their views if you are not face to face. Unfortunately it's human nature.
Other people are just content to watch the world burn - there is no hope for these people!
Members falling out will always happen on this site; it's a site that encourages complete openess with ideas, opinions and feedback. In my opinion it is TDC's greatest strength and is why it is so successful and popular with so many people all around the world. These things have happened many times before and will happen again. My advice is to let these people get on with their issues and move forwards; if an interesting topic gets locked, start a new one where it left off! Rise above other people's problems and arguements!
What I think should be done to get rid of a conflict is that both opposers just forget about it and go on to something else. It won't kill someone to say they were wrong. But for some it's too hard to do.
Edited by W3R3W00F
n/a
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
20th January, 2009 at 21:10:33 -
I'm saying it's impossible to simply forgive and forget at the level of thinking that the general TDC member has. You're talking about attitudes rarely seen on the web, let alone on TDC. The method I suggested would eventually, gradually increase members respect for each other.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
I have a much simpler solution. While you guys are busy slapping one another with phallic vegetables or whatever you call this, I've been hard at work coding my next game!
@Peblo: While it does sound like a good idea, I honestly think locking topics is a pretty good idea already.
And really, if they're given a chance, It's quite probable they won't even resolve at all, and just get worse.
People nowadays won't stop until they're right. It's stupid how they fight for something so meaningless (Well... most of the time.).
And I can see where this will go, where this topic could turn into an arguement. We've had enough of those (Especially the Phizzy ones) to go about. I'll just drop it and go on your side Peblo, Just So we can have at least one less conflict and one more group hug.
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
20th January, 2009 at 22:06:16 -
I have no emotional attachment to my side of things, I just imagine it a better future for TDC. People can still do exactly what they would like, and anyone who likes this way personally for themselves can adopt it along with me. I'm not starting a conflict, I'm instigating an opportunity.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
Topic locks are frustrating sometimes but necessary. Is what you want to say in an internet argument all that important anyway?
People argue not just here but in real life anyway. Sometimes the best thing is to stop them. For the people who are arguing, it can be annoying, (I've been plenty frustrated when trying to sort something out with my brother and being stopped by dad.) but if a topic escalates to a point where it needs to be locked, the arguers are immature enough that no amount of time would be enough for them to sort it.
So really, you ought to be asking admins to really think before they lock a topic, and stay objective. My only beef with some recent locks is that occasionally they are because the admin had some sort of emotional involvement with the argument or got frustrated in a manner unfitting of an admin. (Not wrong to get frustrated, they just didn't react properly. )
Dunno if that is worded the way I'm thinking of... but meh.
It's our job to watch ourselves personally and pay attention to the admins; as well as to make sure the admins we nominate use their discretion wisely. There are no blanket solutions for any problem.
Edited by OMC
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
20th January, 2009 at 22:51:13 -
Hmm, indeed. I can see where the topic locks can be helpful, currently anyways. In that case, the main focus should be on improving the member community spirit, in the long run rendering the need for topic locks. The main way to do this is to really understand each member's point of view before arguing/debating against it. Ask questions before assuming, you know?
One simple step.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
That nobody does. The real first step is teaching our children common sense and courtesy. So TDC may be doomed for the current generation.
But yea, if we get down to it, the real issue is people being rude and argumentative. (And sometimes stupid) If it were easy to fix things like that, the world would be perfect.
Originally Posted by OldManClayton
But yea, if we get down to it, the real issue is people being rude and argumentative. (And sometimes stupid) If it were easy to fix things like that, the world would be perfect.
That's exactly it.
Good to see theres a hopeful bunch around here rising against the descending immaturity and the unfortunate side-effect of topics being locked.
I don't really think letting people say what they want will allow everything to be resolved.
Although locking a topic doesn't seem to make any difference in the long run it certainly stops out of control threads dead in their tracks.
(when actually used on an out of control thread and not ones the Admins decide might be heading in the wrong direction possibly maybe)
.
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
21st January, 2009 at 00:46:18 -
No no, in fact, I think that locking a topic can give people time to cool off and analyze their own perspective and if it's truly how they feel about such argumentative issues. It's just when locks hurt the discussion since no one else can do the topic justice rationally.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
The only time thread locking pisses me off is when an admin abuses it by having their say and throwing out their personal opinions before locking the thread, so that no one can reply to that.
Stupid idea: When people fight, lock them into a topic where they continue their fight until the conflict is resolved. They can only post in this topic until an admin decides they've resolved the issue. Again, that was a stupid idea.
Also, I'm no longer Psuedo-HD Rikus, as Rikus changed his avatar.
In the past admins have had a last say on the thread before locking it, but it's kinda been agreed on that any admins that have been personally related to on the thread can't lock it. Or front page their games, articles, projects. Or recommend their own games. That sort of thing. These days, even when locking your own topic, the admin usually doesn't comment on anything, other than why the topic was locked, because it might be considered "a statement nobody could reply to".
Anyway, from what I've seen, topic locks are a way to keep the flames from getting bigger. And since TDCers have a habit of straying far off topic, topic locks tend to occur to cut that habit.
Topics in other forums are locked much more quickly, IMHO. It's just that TDCers don't grasp the idea that starting fights on threads or derailing them from the original post is a bad thing. Heck, almost every forum I know have a "Random Thoughts/Babble thread", so you could let out whatever you feel like talking about or spamming, without messing up someone's thread.
What I don't like are topic deletions. Now those are annoying. I'm grateful for whoever coded in the topic locking.
Originally Posted by RedEchidna And now this is the part where an admin ironically comes in and locks this topic! *shot*
Administrative Message: This topic has been locked.
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
, IMHO. It's just that TDCers don't grasp the idea that starting fights on threads or derailing them from the original post is a bad thing.
I don't think derailing is a bad thing. Most conversations gradually change In real life. Could you imagine how annoying it would be if while talking someone yells at you "OFF TOPIC" as the conversation gradually changes.
Originally Posted by OldManClayton Topic locks are frustrating sometimes but necessary. Is what you want to say in an internet argument all that important anyway?
People argue not just here but in real life anyway. Sometimes the best thing is to stop them. For the people who are arguing, it can be annoying, (I've been plenty frustrated when trying to sort something out with my brother and being stopped by dad.) but if a topic escalates to a point where it needs to be locked, the arguers are immature enough that no amount of time would be enough for them to sort it.
So really, you ought to be asking admins to really think before they lock a topic, and stay objective. My only beef with some recent locks is that occasionally they are because the admin had some sort of emotional involvement with the argument or got frustrated in a manner unfitting of an admin. (Not wrong to get frustrated, they just didn't react properly. )
Dunno if that is worded the way I'm thinking of... but meh.
It's our job to watch ourselves personally and pay attention to the admins; as well as to make sure the admins we nominate use their discretion wisely. There are no blanket solutions for any problem.
i whole heartedly agree with this. its like they say. "arguing on the internet is like racing in the special olympics. even if you win, youre still retarded."
, IMHO. It's just that TDCers don't grasp the idea that starting fights on threads or derailing them from the original post is a bad thing.
I don't think derailing is a bad thing. Most conversations gradually change In real life. Could you imagine how annoying it would be if while talking someone yells at you "OFF TOPIC" as the conversation gradually changes.
It's no problem if the original topic was about something casual like movies, birthdays, games, and you stray off topic. Conversational topics are fine to stray from.
It's a problem if the poster asked about something, ask for advice, suggests something, or anything where an answer is expected at all. I mean seriously, in a conversation, if someone asks, "Hey, I'm having some problems with my computer!", and you reply something comparing computers to TVs. And then everyone at tech support talks about TVs. Not very polite.
But yeah, locking might not be the best solution there either. I think the admins are using it as a way to show that they frown upon such behavior. To say, "All of you get out of here and go to your rooms."
Edited by Muz
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
21st January, 2009 at 05:40:46 -
The internet is a form of communication. Arguing on the internet and in real life are just the same. It's not a productive behavior to what most say their goals are, but that's most's choice.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
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Edited by Peblo
But for some it's too hard to do.
