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Silveraura
God's God
Registered
08/08/2002
Points
6747
         
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28th December, 2010 at 06:03:03 -
In short, the event editor is an easy to understand graph. Events listed in order on the left, objects that events effect across the top. Intersections on the grid are actions.
*The event editor is limited though because actions occur in the order which you made them and it's impossible to easily change this without the event list editor.
*The event list editor shows you the condition and below it, all the actions and in the order they're processed. It makes the whole process a lot easier to visualize in your head and also gives you the ability to drag and drop actions to change their order.
**However the event list editor suffers from turning out like a really, really long list unless you're simply using it on a per-event basis - kind of defeating the purpose of using MMF2 instead of just going out and learning how to program in a real language.
My personal recommendation is to work in the event editor and then use the event list editor to edit individual events. This expands your options and gives your the advantages of both, bypassing the disadvantages of both.
TGF2 is pathetic though and not worth the $50 price tag, and the Newgrounds Edition? Well, you'd be better off making a game in Microsoft Paint. Yes, it's that bad.
http://www.facebook.com/truediamondgame
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Sketchy
Cornwall UK
Registered
06/11/2004
Points
1970
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28th December, 2010 at 11:10:08 -
What's wrong with the Newgrounds version? Is it not exactly the same as the standard version, apart from the build options? I admit I haven't paid it much attention.
Which reminds me - does TGF2 have the Java/J2ME/HWA builds, or are they MMF2-only?
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Silveraura
God's God
Registered
08/08/2002
Points
6747
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28th December, 2010 at 20:00:57 -
Originally Posted by Sketchy
What's wrong with the Newgrounds version? Is it not exactly the same as the standard version, apart from the build options? I admit I haven't paid it much attention.
Which reminds me - does TGF2 have the Java/J2ME/HWA builds, or are they MMF2-only?
It's severely limited - more so then TGF2.
Take TGF2, strip even more features away, strip away anything that wont work in Flash, and then limit them to only be able to compile in flash. Then make it so that the flash will only work on one specific website.
Yeah, TGF2 - Newgrounds Edition is a joke. I'm impressed Clickteam has the right idea when it comes to putting themselves out there, but this is a horrible, horrible, first impression on the software. If TGF2 or especially TGF2 Newgrounds was the first time I ever used the software, I'd drop it in a heartbeat.
http://www.facebook.com/truediamondgame
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GamesterXIII
Registered
04/12/2008
Points
1110
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29th December, 2010 at 02:28:12 -
Originally Posted by SiLVERFIRE
Originally Posted by Sketchy
What's wrong with the Newgrounds version? Is it not exactly the same as the standard version, apart from the build options? I admit I haven't paid it much attention.
Which reminds me - does TGF2 have the Java/J2ME/HWA builds, or are they MMF2-only?
It's severely limited - more so then TGF2.
Take TGF2, strip even more features away, strip away anything that wont work in Flash, and then limit them to only be able to compile in flash. Then make it so that the flash will only work on one specific website.
Yeah, TGF2 - Newgrounds Edition is a joke. I'm impressed Clickteam has the right idea when it comes to putting themselves out there, but this is a horrible, horrible, first impression on the software. If TGF2 or especially TGF2 Newgrounds was the first time I ever used the software, I'd drop it in a heartbeat.
Why would you want things that can't work in flash in a version thats made exclusively for flash?
I seriously doubt you would drop TGF2 if you were new to it. You started with TGF 1 did you not? You certainly didn't drop that and TGF2 is lightyears ahead of TGF1 in every way possible. TGF1 is an unstable, buggy POS compared to it  .
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Ricky
loves Left For Dead 2
Registered
28/12/2006
Points
4175
  
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29th December, 2010 at 02:36:54 -
All you need are fast loops and actives. And new-grounds tgf2 has both. Some people are spoiled by extensions 
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Sketchy
Cornwall UK
Registered
06/11/2004
Points
1970
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29th December, 2010 at 03:35:31 -
@Gamester-
True, but back in the days of TGF1/KnP, Clickteam's products were cheaper, and there wasn't really any alternative anyway, let alone a free one. Now there are numerous freeware copycats - some of which offer a level of functionality to rival MMF2 (eg. Construct).
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Silveraura
God's God
Registered
08/08/2002
Points
6747
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29th December, 2010 at 09:58:36 -
Originally Posted by GamesterXIII
Originally Posted by SiLVERFIRE
Originally Posted by Sketchy
What's wrong with the Newgrounds version? Is it not exactly the same as the standard version, apart from the build options? I admit I haven't paid it much attention.
Which reminds me - does TGF2 have the Java/J2ME/HWA builds, or are they MMF2-only?
It's severely limited - more so then TGF2.
Take TGF2, strip even more features away, strip away anything that wont work in Flash, and then limit them to only be able to compile in flash. Then make it so that the flash will only work on one specific website.
Yeah, TGF2 - Newgrounds Edition is a joke. I'm impressed Clickteam has the right idea when it comes to putting themselves out there, but this is a horrible, horrible, first impression on the software. If TGF2 or especially TGF2 Newgrounds was the first time I ever used the software, I'd drop it in a heartbeat.
Why would you want things that can't work in flash in a version thats made exclusively for flash?
I seriously doubt you would drop TGF2 if you were new to it. You started with TGF 1 did you not? You certainly didn't drop that and TGF2 is lightyears ahead of TGF1 in every way possible. TGF1 is an unstable, buggy POS compared to it .
Actually TGF1 was extremely simple and easy to take up.
MMF 1.5 made the whole thing more indepth but trickier to use. MMF2 improved it, but not to the simplicity of TGF1 which is good for people who know how to use it and new comers who want something pretty powerful, but people like who I was when I first started using TGF1 probably wont be too attracted to MMF2 as much as I was TGF1. That's not to say TGF1 is better, MMF2 is by far, a lot better, but the appeal just isn't as strong.
Also, when I meant that TGF2 couldn't do things that wasn't flash enabled, I wasn't suggesting that it should be able to... I was suggesting that it was just one many limitations to the software that new comers just will-not-understand or put up with. To them, it'll just be one big selling scam. "Want this? Want this? BUY IT!" So but no, what I meant wasn't so much that they should add the features that don't work in Flash - what they should do is not add more to the already punishing limitations of only being able to make Flash games that only work on one site. If you NEED to take at least one step back, why on earth would you take 5 more steps back, just to make it "free".
Clickteam has a really unique and powerful piece of software here. The last thing they need to do is lazily strip features away from it to distribute it. I mean I understand MMF2 vs MMF2 Developer. What I don't understand is why TGF2 can't be cheaper and work more like a fully functional piece of software that encourages you to upgrade to a better version, instead of... essentially what is a paid for demo that just doesn't expire.
http://www.facebook.com/truediamondgame
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Duncan
Thelonious Dunc
Registered
18/05/2002
Points
552
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30th December, 2010 at 13:45:25 -
TGF2:NE is targeted at the common schmuck who wants to make Flash games. They'll be motivated to upgrade in order to live the dream and make fractions of cents off of their garbage. Basically, it's perfect.
TGF2:NE and presumably TGF2 lack the full event list editor, yes, but you can still use the per-event version thereof (i.e., double click an event, rearrange and manipulate conditions displayed as a text list, press esc to go back again, etc.).
I mainly use the main event editor as I usually code in order and I have a ton of things down to a science, but there are times where I have to go back into the list editor to perform repetitive motions or to manipulate which order the events are in.
So yep, you can do this. It's still a lazy omission, but it won't seriously cripple what you can do.
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GamesterXIII
Registered
04/12/2008
Points
1110
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30th December, 2010 at 13:59:28 -
Oh haha thats still a version of the event list editor then. Why the hell are people complaining about it then? -_-.
Thanks for the false impression, TDCers! Standard TGF 2 doesn't seem so bad given that.
Next question : Is there a HWA for TGF 2?
Nevermind that last question just found the answer.
 Edited by GamesterXIII
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Sketchy
Cornwall UK
Registered
06/11/2004
Points
1970
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30th December, 2010 at 14:32:41 -
I did explain the difference between the two editors quite clearly.
If you got the wrong impression, you should blame Clickteam for not giving them more sensible names.
There's still the issue of extensions, which may or may not be a problem, depending on which you use. A lot of them don't do anything you couldn't already do by other means - they just make it a lot easier and/or more efficient. Some you couldn't possibly hope to replace.
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GamesterXIII
Registered
04/12/2008
Points
1110
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30th December, 2010 at 14:54:36 -
Yeah some can't be replaced, but fortunately I don't use any extensions.
I think I may use things such as viewport in the future, but they aren't a 100% necessity for me.
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Silveraura
God's God
Registered
08/08/2002
Points
6747
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30th December, 2010 at 18:38:11 -
Originally Posted by Duncan TGF2:NE is targeted at the common schmuck who wants to make Flash games. They'll be motivated to upgrade in order to live the dream and make fractions of cents off of their garbage. Basically, it's perfect.
TGF2:NE and presumably TGF2 lack the full event list editor, yes, but you can still use the per-event version thereof (i.e., double click an event, rearrange and manipulate conditions displayed as a text list, press esc to go back again, etc.).
I mainly use the main event editor as I usually code in order and I have a ton of things down to a science, but there are times where I have to go back into the list editor to perform repetitive motions or to manipulate which order the events are in.
So yep, you can do this. It's still a lazy omission, but it won't seriously cripple what you can do.
How is this a lazy omission. Apparently what you consider lazy, I consider efficient. Not everything has to be a long drawn out process. In fact, considering software is there to aid in producing things, not be a hurdle to jump over to get to the finish, I'd say the simplest effective way to do anything is always the best.
And no, neither default movement nor using instable extensions for everything you want to do, are "effective" ways to do anything, so as simple as they are, they shouldn't even be considered in my opinion.
http://www.facebook.com/truediamondgame
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Duncan
Thelonious Dunc
Registered
18/05/2002
Points
552
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30th December, 2010 at 19:10:24 -
Are you the same person who posted up there? You said
The last thing they need to do is lazily strip features away from it to distribute it.
And I thought that's how we were all describing the absence of the full list editor!
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Jon Lambert
Administrator
Vaporware Master
Registered
19/12/2004
Points
8235
  
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30th December, 2010 at 20:08:35 -
Originally Posted by Sketchyhttp://www.clickteam.co.uk/compareproducts.php
Basically, TGF2 just isn't up to the job, as it lacks extensions and the event list editor (the event editor sucks). It's actually inferior to MMF1 (IMO Clickteam should be giving it away free of charge).
The additional extensions you get with the Dev version are really only useful if you're making applications, rather than games. It costs 3 times as much as the Std version, so it's not going to be worth it unless you're *very* serious about making commercial products.
MMF2  ev only extensions:-
dialog box
data grid
double precision calculator
email object
explorer
list view
masked edit
OS
process viewer
quick hash object
regular expressions object
spellcheck object
trial period object
xml parser object
YASO object
We also have:
SQLite 3 Pro
Character Image
Registry++
Integrated Path Planning Object
COM+ object
Regular Expressions
Sphax Kernel
And these runtimes:
Stand-alone Java Application
Stand-alone Java for Mobile
Stand-alone Java for Blackberry
Stand-alone Mac Application (Java)
Java sub-application
And the MDI feature that was mentioned on that chart. Also, I thought you weren't allowed to sell TGF2 applications at all?
TGF2 doesn't get to build anything besides .exe, .ccn, .scr, and .swf right?
Sorry if I'm being redundant, I just wanted a more comprehensive list.
Sandwich Time!Whoo!
JoyCheck & KeyCheck Widgets
For easy implementation of customizable joystick and keyboard controls.
http://www.create-games.com/download.asp?id=8364
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GamesterXIII
Registered
04/12/2008
Points
1110
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1st January, 2011 at 04:32:54 -
If it can build .exes and has an HWA version i'm sold. I can always easily upgrade to MMF2 later on down the road.
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